bittah.com!~ The Great T:A Rule Review

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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 2:28 pm

The Great T:A Rule Review

I know hardly anyone left here cares about T:A, but I thought I'd duplicate my post from TANZ here to capture the opinions of some people who may not read there but still have an interest. From my TANZ post:
So whilst I realise there has been little movement in the rules since the last discussion (what’s going on Heff?) I wanted to start another one, partly because I’m bored and partly because I think these rules are dumb/excessive/ill-conceived/crutches for bad yanks/less is more (and I will state why). If the rules move in a direction that promotes skill & diversifies gameplay, muffins may even make a return!

Incoming wall of text issues & reasoning below:
Spoiler: Show
SENTINEL

Basically I only agree with the SEN limit, and am on the fence RE: the skin ban but can at least understand why it is banned relative to the other skins…it has a slight advantage over stock skin, especially when jammed.

Issue: Ban SAP or Rage but not both

Why: Agree we need to address the SAP/Rage combo issue, but banning both is too much. Quality SENs are few and far between these days, and with all the nerfs to D you need to throw something their way

Solution: Unban SAP or Rage. If you unban SAP you force a choice between weapons, which is a good thing. HOWEVER, it is easier to police a weapon ban than a perk ban, so maybe you are better off unbanning Rage.

___________________________________

Issue: Claymore/mine ban

Why: Has previously been discussed at length.

Solution: Allowing claymores but disallowing DMB mines would be a good compromise. It means the SEN needs to play closer to stand if wanting to utilise these tools & be a bit more proactive.



INFILTRATOR

Again I only agree with the limit and the smoke mine ban. Personally I wouldn’t care (and would probably prefer) if the entire class was banned, but that isn’t going to stop me for arguing on the side of logic.

Issue: Jackal ban

Why: Weapon has been heavily reviewed & nerfed multiple times since its first OP release. Now next to useless and little used. Is it really that much of a threat we have to ban it?

Solution: Unban it unless someone can make a good case as to how it ruins the game/meta?

___________________________________

Issue: Prism mine ban

Why: Similar arguments to other mines etc. At the end of the day, would anyone really use them for D or O in a match? And if they did, do you really think it would be more advantageous than other classes or solutions? Should we not encourage people to at least experiment with that sort of thing? I feel like the yanks reached this decision after getting tired of being trolled in pubs by infs on flag or raping base, but really would anyone ever bother with that tactic in a match environment? If they do and it worked, good on them IMO (and bad on them to the enemy O for failing to clear a one shot class or item).

Solution: Unban it unless someone can make a good case as to how it ruins the game/meta?



SOLDIER

I only agree with proxy ban as they are auto-aim nades and allow self-clearing for cappers.

Issue: Shortfuse ban

Why: Reflects an earlier time/era when short fuses were OP and hard to spot. Now they do far less damage, have a smaller radius and glow bright fucking yellow. No one uses them – AP+ST is the new soldier nade meta. Unban them.

Solution: Unban it unless someone can make a good case as to how it ruins the game/meta?



TECHNICIAN

I don’t really agree with any of the TCN restrictions to be honest. If we want the meta to evolve, you need to make this class useful again and bring gens back into play.

Issue: Shortfuse ban

Why: As per arguments for Soldier

Solution: Unban it unless someone can make a good case as to how it ruins the game/meta?

___________________________________

Issue: Motion sensor ban

Why: As previously discussed

Solution: Unban it unless someone can make a good case as to how it ruins the game/meta?

___________________________________

Issue: Repair kit ban

Why: I understand this gives the TCN the ability to be in multiple places at once, but running one is still a trade off vs other classes and the class remains unused except in the odd situation a team wants to get a shrike out.
I feel if you unbanned this you should leave the 2x turret rule in place, but if you keep these banned the 2x turret limit should be removed since there is no incentive to try 2x TCN under that rule. 1 would just be a full time repair monkey and the other would be better off being a soldier since you can’t utilise all of his features (moar turrets). Again, I feel the trade off decision to run 2x TCN should be come with all the attendant benefits, not just the risks.

WARNING: I do feel this has the biggest potential to impact the meta, as it will mean we will see more TCNs and there will be more gens/turrets up. Given the extreme aversion the remaining community seems to have in giving the offence any job to do other than turn up at the flag stand & shoot triangles, I don’t expect you to take the hard road, even if it is the better one in terms of diversity and challenge :(

Solution: Unban it and limit TCN to 1

___________________________________

Issue: 2 Turret Limit

Why: This rule only makes sense in the context of repair kits being allowed, not banned as they presently are. There is no incentive to run a second TCN if you can’t use his turrets. Better off running 1x TCN as repair monkey and put the other guy in soldier for example. But if we didn’t limit turrets, then all of a sudden the second TCN starts to look like a more viable option.

Repair kits fuck this situation up, which is why if you vote yes to repair kits you should limit TCN to 1 (which instantly limits turrets to 2 anyway).

Solution: Remove 2 turret limit or unban rep kit



DOOMBRINGER

I notice DMB defective frags are not included in the rules…possibly oversight, but I feel these should remain unbanned for the same reason as short fuse grenades. You already know my feelings on mines but as the community seems pretty split on that I’ll leave it alone and focus on the other dumb rule:

Issue: One FF limit

Why: What is the purpose of this rule? When are the gens ever up anyway? If the DMB can manage to keep gens up AND get both FF’s out your offence deserves to run into an easily disced away wall IMO.

Solution: Unban it unless someone can make a good case as to how it ruins the game/meta?
Here is what my proposed rule set would look like:
# Pathfinder
- No restrictions

# Sentinel
- Limit of 1 per team
- SAP ban
- Spectre Skin

# Infiltrator
- Limit of 1 per team
- Smoke grenades

# Soldier
- Proximity grenades

# Raider
- No restrictions

# Technician
- Limit of 1 per team

# Juggernaut
- No restrictions

# Doombringer
- Mines

# Brute
- No restrictions

Vehicle limits & prices to remain unchanged.

To try and get some hard statistics and actionable results out of this, I’ve created a survey to capture the responses. HOWEVER, I’m not going to open this survey up to the unwashed masses because some of you are unable to resist the urge to troll and an anonymous survey tends to bring out the worst in you, so here is how it is going to work:

1) The survey is open to anyone, but you must register first.

2) You register by providing an email address via PM to myself, Heff/Lenny or the Superusers. We will then add your provided email address to the survey, allowing you to log in and record your responses.

3) Your responses will be recorded against your email login details. All responses are all optional, so please only answer ones where you have an opinion and you feel you can justify it. You can review your response at any stage if someone presents a convincing argument that changes your mind, so you aren't locked in till the final whistle & you can view other people's responses (just try not to be a sheep!)

4) Survey admins reserve the right to contact participants and discuss their responses. If they are unable to justify or explain a particular response, it will be discounted/removed (if you can’t explain why you don’t deserve a say because you lack the requisite knowledge).

5) Responses will be collated at the end of an agreed period (perhaps 2 weeks?) and then it’s up to Heff as to what he does with the answers, but one would hope he takes the majority position and ignores the wah’s from the people who don’t get their way (myself included :p ) I have no issue making the responses public, but will await community feedback on that before doing so.

The survey is ready to roll so feel free to PM me for inclusion, and I will add Heff, Lencorp +Superusers to the list of collaborators for the survey once I get their email details from them, then they will be able to issue it out as well as I'm not on here that much. It's only 10 questions so should take you all of 5 minutes to complete. Easy!

*your email address will remain private and confidential...unless you act like a complete tool & try to disrupt the process, in which case I can't promise some Nigerians won't get it :p
So yeah, PM me if you want to join the survey and I'll add you in :)
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 2:39 pm

the people in the comp have ruined the game completely

playing TA in any form these days is so annoying only new school tards can handle it

/end
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 2:58 pm

Re: The Great T:A Rule Review

Yeah the rules are beyond retarded - all aimed at lowering the skill bar, not raising it.

But after a 6 month hiatus my team mates & I have started scrimming once a week so have had to conform to these gheyarse restrictive rules. If they weren't so fucked we may even make a comeback, hence the primary motivation for my post (and I also still care about the community/game even if I don't play as much as I used to)
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 3:27 pm

Speaking of TA - does anyone on this entire website actually read that Bart twitterfeed and other misc crap down the bottom?
Deepjay
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 5:02 pm

Speaking of TA - does anyone on this entire website actually read that Bart twitterfeed and other misc crap down the bottom?
bart still works for hirez?


...hirez are still in business?
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 5:23 pm

the people in the comp have ruined the game completely

playing TA in any form these days is so annoying only new school tards can handle it

/end
Its exactly the same as it has been for the last year and a half dude.

People hack and get away with it too. Today Dodge and I were on a server with a smurf who was hacking and actively admitted to it, not to make us rage but moreso to show that its 100% possible and easy enough to do. Apparently its about dll injections or something? I'm not sure, Dodge was trying to get him into mumble to discuss. Did you get any more info out of him?
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 6:42 pm

He came on mumble but he didn't tell me much about it, just said that a few other tribes members have aim that is similar. When I dueled him it was really weird, he said you had to do some tweaking to get it to work, as in the aim-bot. He said people who aim like milk and hurlz seem to have the same type of bot he was using. It took me 1 google search to find the infinite jet hack and I'm sure with more then 1 minute of searching you could find the aim-bot one, I don't think hi-rez are going to do anything about it though. It's hard to tell if people are legit or not to because I could still beat the hacker but I couldn't when I got within 10m of him. Didn't even realize he was until I went inf and he tracked me when I ran around him.
These rules aren't for shit players, hell only time people got out was because of proxy spam and the only time people where getting stopped was because mines. O is easy, D is extremely harder. These rules aren't there to suit shit players it's to remove the scummy tactics out of the game, shame we can't ban inf completely without buffing SEN.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 6:48 pm

I reckon if you kept the rage/SAP ban (already significant nerf to SEN) and *maybe* banned falcon/shotty, you could quite comfortably get rid of the invisible tribe completely.

I'd fucking love that.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 6:49 pm

yeah its really weird.

they don't hit EVERY bullet...but if you get within a certain radius nearly everything hits and you get melted in under 2 seconds in light...crazy shit.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 6:49 pm

I reckon if you kept the rage/SAP ban (already significant nerf to SEN) and maybe banned falcon/shotty, you could quite comfortably get rid of the invisible tribe.

I'd fucking love that.

bloody oath mate, would be fantastic!
definitely need to ban both the falcon and shotty though so that the SEN is next to useless in close combat.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 6:50 pm

There is a trade-off between using the falcon and the shotty. Shotty only really rips through heavies. Falcon is the most OP of the two imo.

Also re: hacks I suspect those sort of hacks also have an option where you can activate/deactivate it quite easily (either toggle on/off or hold to auto-aim type thing)
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 6:58 pm

Yeah he was turning it on/off when I was talking to him.
Shotty>falcon, it's one of the strongest shotguns in the game. Ban all secondaries for SEN then we can remove inf :D. The nova has extreme dps and even I can aim semi-decent with it.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 7:08 pm

Admittedly I don't have much SEN experience, but I found the falcon a lot easier to get kills with across more classes. I think you have to give the SEN at least some form of secondary - at least the novas have small clips and require some aim.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 7:45 pm

Bart...apc...same shit
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 8:10 pm

Admittedly I don't have much SEN experience, but I found the falcon a lot easier to get kills with across more classes. I think you have to give the SEN at least some form of secondary - at least the novas have small clips and require some aim.
Definitely agree with leaving the Nova's in. They need a secondary.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 8:12 pm

There is a trade-off between using the falcon and the shotty. Shotty only really rips through heavies. Falcon is the most OP of the two imo.

Also re: hacks I suspect those sort of hacks also have an option where you can activate/deactivate it quite easily (either toggle on/off or hold to auto-aim type thing)
Shotty rips through everything bro!

Definitely. Thats 100% spot on, a toggle would be half the problem from identifying who is legit and who isn't.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 8:34 pm

Stick with projectiles and it doesn't matter
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 9:09 pm

I prefer not playing inf while sen harassing anyway. Inf isn't necessary to counter sen it's just easiest and the other classes need to be played differently, unless the sen is super mobile then inf is useless.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 9:56 pm

I prefer not playing inf while sen harassing anyway. Inf isn't necessary to counter sen it's just easiest and the other classes need to be played differently, unless the sen is super mobile then inf is useless.
I agree, I reckon a soldier is best.
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Post » Fri May 24, 2013 9:59 pm

u cant resolve this stuff guys unless u REMOVE sent, then other shit gets broken

same old argument thats been going since early beta

imbalanced game is imbalanced
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