bittah.com!~ [Movie] Captain 'Murica and the Winter Soldier (2014)

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Post » Sun Apr 13, 2014 2:56 pm

[Movie] Captain 'Murica and the Winter Soldier (2014)

[One-Liner]
- More of a DVD flick this one tbh, really didn't do much for me and was imo a pretty average Phase 2 movie

[Plot]
- Cap is having a Spiderman 3 emo moment in this movie
- OK... almost the entire movie...
- S.H.I.E.L.D. are involved with a plan to launch three Helicarrier crafts with enough firepower to detect a terrorist's DNA and obliterate them before they become an issue ( :yellow_laugh: ) or some shit
- He thought he knew what he was fighting for... now he's conflicted... is S.H.I.E.L.D. the force of good he thought it was?
- But then "completely unexpected" things happen with Nick Fury and S.H.I.E.L.D. and these ships and he is forced fight evil once again
- DUN DUN DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUN
- The movie has two post-movie spoiler scenes... don't wait around for the one right the credits as it's pretty shit
Spoiler: Show
First scene shows Hydra scientists playing with Loki's staff, and then reveals Quicksilver and The Scarlet Witch in their cells
Spoiler: Show
Second scene shows Bucky back in the Museum looking at the information about him... and then the screen goes black
[Pros]
- Action is OK... although really the only bits I really enjoyed involved Falcon
- Winter Soldier arc is a bit cliche, but has one of the nicer moments in the movie towards the end, and interesting to see where they take him now
- Stan Lee's cameo is nice too

[Cons]
- Doesn't go anywhere fast... the entire movie is plodding along until Cap finally grows some balls at the end
- ScarJo has a much larger role but about as much acting range as Jennifer Garner in Dallas Buyer's Club
- The "twists" are pretty transparent
Spoiler: Show
especially involving Fury
and play out rather awkwardly
- Whoever wrote the jokes and the dialogue needs a punch in the taint, it has all these.... awful........... pauses or.... back-and-forth exchanges.......... between the .......... characters in the conversation just....... before the punchline........... or quip......... which usually aren't funny or poignant either
- GSP is rather wasted as Batroc... one fairly low-key fight and then nothing... also how the fuck is he strong enough to take on Cap? It's never really explained...

[Rating]
2.5 KFC buckets out of 5 (.5 because the last 15 minutes literally saved this movie for me)
KFC
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Post » Sun Apr 13, 2014 7:06 pm

Spoiler: Show
I thought it was pretty poor. If I wanted to watch half an hour of a helicarrier slowly falling out of the sky I'd watch The Avengers again.

And for a supposedly "ultimate weapon" they sure had a lot of trouble shooting one man with a jetpack out of the sky.
Last edited by Xandrax on Mon Apr 14, 2014 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post » Sun Apr 13, 2014 9:12 pm

Agree with most of what was said above, however I did enjoy it a bit more than that... had to ignore the usual silly plot holes as well. I mean when you're wondering who you can trust and the fate of the world is in jeopardy surely you'll be giving a call to the other Avengers (it's one rather glaring problem when doing these movies after they've all been linked together).
Most of the 'twists' were pretty obvious though... still enjoyed it though.
3.5/5 from me. It's getting 8+/10 on imdb which is pretty decent.
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Post » Sun Apr 13, 2014 10:08 pm

I liked it, it is def up there with the better of marvel films so far for me. If you were expecting a Schindlers list you went to the wrong movie KFC.

I really like how the effects of Cap 2 have flowed into the Agents of Sheild tv show as well.
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 7:29 am

I've never overly liked Captain America as a superhero, so have never been too interested in these movies. I also found him the least interesting of the avengers movie.

What does phase me though is the new Spider-Man movie pulling average reviews (6ish score). Gah!

They're saying that it's too busy, too much stuff going on. So unsurprising. Soon as I found out there were 3 supervillians I knew it'd end up that way. Gah. Gah. Gah I say.
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 9:56 am

And that for me was the biggest issue here. He's just a dull character in a movie that just goes nowhere... really slowly...

I'm not expecting Schindler's List either, and can suspend disbelief (e.g. Luke destroying the Death Star) in these types of movies, but literally here nothing much happens. Apart from the odd choreographed-to-hell fight or waif-thin conspiracy theory. Meh.

Haven't seen the new Spiderman movies, but yeah I could see that being a criticism given the trailer.
KFC
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 11:58 am

I'm with Larno on this, I reckon it was really good. And helicarriers crashing is nearly as big a trope in the comics as characters coming back from the dead, it made me smile.

Pro tip: view the Marvel movies as live action cartoons/comics, it makes them so much better.

Loved - Falcon's chem with Cap, Scarjo's arse, the portrayal of Cap's skill and powers, namedropping Stephen Strange, combining with Agents of SHIELD to begin explaining superpowered humans (as they aren't allowed to use "mutant" as an explanation), Scarjo's rack.

and...
Spoiler: Show
There was some foreshadowing to support my theory that Bucky will take up Cap's shield when Evans goes off-contract. I think Evans is only signed on for 3 more movies, the actor that plays Bucky signed on for 9 in total (huge for a minor supporting character/villain).
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 12:08 pm

Spoiler: Show
There was some foreshadowing to support my theory that Bucky will take up Cap's shield when Evans goes off-contract. I think Evans is only signed on for 3 more movies, the actor that plays Bucky signed on for 9 in total (huge for a minor supporting character/villain).
Spoiler: Show
Well... not really that minor, or surprising really given the Winter Soldier takes over from Captain America in the comics after he's "assassinated." But that's all to come I daresay.
KFC
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 12:31 pm

The first Amazing Spiderman was really good actually - the new guy, Andy Garfield I think his name was, is actually a very good Peter Parker. I'm sure that's the same in this second one - but man, too many big name baddies...any one of the three could have been enough (well maybe not the green goblin as he was the villian in all three of the original movies) but yeah.
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:16 pm

- GSP is rather wasted as Batroc... one fairly low-key fight and then nothing... also how the f**k is he strong enough to take on Cap? It's never really explained...
I forgot to comment on this. I thought the same thing... It's like they thought that because this guy was being played by GSP that should make him a badass. And maybe he is... but it takes something a bit more to be superhuman.
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 1:26 pm

I get that the character exists in the comics, and he fought Captain America a number of times... but he just seems like such a disposable character in this movie. Like they might've been contemplating him as a bigger villain but then changed the plot.

He may show up in the next one again and get a bit more coverage. But yeah in this movie it was a bit too subtle and therefore a waste tbh.
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 2:51 pm

havent seen cpnt merica yet supposed to be pretty good. love they added the falcon as well. hope he get some screen time to kick ass

as far as the spider man reboot, well frankly its shit. peter was played as a smart mouth hood, out of the costume. parker was never like that without the costume on, it was kind of the whole point of it. mild mannered nerd changes his persona when haveing a mask on. i will say the costume looked great and the gwen stacy b4 mary jane is another good addition but only because the goblin killing her is on of the moments that make spider man into who he is.
and did we realy need another reboot to a franchise that was already well established?!? i dont need to sit thru yet another origin story. but i guess spiderman 3 did kind of suck hard.
if annyhting needs a reboot or a complete over huale its the abomination that is xmen. man they realy fuked that up, cyclops one of the coolest xmen is a little punk and then dies of. gtfo.
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Post » Mon Apr 14, 2014 3:08 pm

Oh yeah could go on for ages about that extended comic -> movie failure.

But let's try not to derail this :D
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Post » Mon Apr 21, 2014 2:04 am

Hydra has developed an algorithm that selects and kills bad guys, aka those opposed to Hydra. Anyone remember Iron Man 1 and his Jarvis algorithm that selects and kills the bad Arabs from the good ones in the desert?
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Post » Mon Apr 21, 2014 7:29 am

Yeah but that was based on whether they were a threat or not wasn't it?

Not by scanning their DNA... :yellow_laugh:
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Post » Mon Apr 21, 2014 12:42 pm

Yeah but that was based on whether they were a threat or not wasn't it?

Not by scanning their DNA... :yellow_laugh:
Which determines whether they're a threat or not... (comic book science, but this is a comic book movie).

I'm guessing the similarity in "concept" between Jarvis' targeting (Iron Man doesn't target, Jarvis does) and Hydra's AI is not accidental. Probably be a reveal somewhere down the line revolving around Tony and his daddy. (Just a guess).
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Post » Mon Apr 21, 2014 12:56 pm

Thinking about it a little more, the idea of "threat" selection has been fairly prominent in many of the Marvel films (IM series, Avengers, Cap 2). What Hydra has done with their AI targeting is just what Jarvis does taken to the end of the line.

When seen that way, is what Iron Man is (armour + Jarvis with some dude in the suit -- although not anymore after IM3 showed us Jarvis-only controlled suits) just Hydra-lite?

The link to USA bombing "terrorist" "threats" in their mountain caves with drones is pretty obvious. Stark is basically the embodiment of American liberal (which in itself is often a contradiction -- after all, Stark fights for free speech and privatization, before invading a generic Arab state with his American-made superweapon), and so I'm thinking it's more and more likely that Howard Stark is going to be involved in Hydra (after all, eliminating "threats" is America's modus operandi).

Of course, they won't have the balls to tell us that Howard was bad like Hydra, and instead will make him out to have had "good intentions" or something. They already started copping out of that by making him Hydra's first "assassination" in Cap 2.
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Post » Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:30 pm

I had a feeling reading your thoughts on a film called "Captain America: The Winter Soldier" would make me want to punch babies.
It wasn't as bad as expected, kudos.

I like Cap. He represents the ideal, not the flag, and he isn't afraid to go rogue when they clash. Timely and necessary.
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Post » Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:16 pm

I had a feeling reading your thoughts on a film called "Captain America: The Winter Soldier" would make me want to punch babies.
It wasn't as bad as expected, kudos.
Scrotleg! I obviously need to up my game.

Here's something obvious: the title of the film is telling us that Captain America is the Winter Soldier, as well as the named character in the film, AKA Bucky. (Read up on Winter Solider Investigation here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_Sol ... estigation) -- the reason I say this is because Captain America says at some point in the film to fury something like: We compromised. We did some bad things, but we did it so that people could be free. That's his admission of war crimes. Not his, personally, but his, as a representation of, like you say, the US ideal back then.

That the US ideal has committed atrocities is probably the main point, though. The veterans from the Vietnam war were displaced people, lost in some kind of limbo, caught between serving the state, and the liberal political backlash that proceeded it. Captain America is similar. He is caught in a murky area between two distinct worlds: His own, where he fought for freedom, and where he took no bullshit whatsoever, and the current world, where he fights for selective "freedom" (Why destroy Hydra, but no the CIA? Why take down Shield, but not Stark Inc.?)

Captain America has completely sold out. In Cap 1, he would never have stood for the bullshit hypocrisy that he does in Cap 2. I mean, the Apple store used on film was no accident (as much as people may like to think filmmakers are a bunch of dumb gits). In other words, Cap has switched sides. He no longer stands for the downtrodden, the oppressed, the proletariat (like he does in Cap 1, being a weakling with an unstoppable heart). He no longer stands for empathy. Now he stands for compromise, something he would never have before. Now he stands for a preferred side, rather than a preferred idea.

After all, what do we see at the end of the movie? All those "good" shield agents filtering off into other organisations. That woman into Stark. Agent 13 into the CIA (lol! ). They only way they could have made that more obvious is if they replayed Armin Zola's voice over it, going: When one head falls, two more rise to take it's place!

Hydra is an idea. Much like it was a parasite in Shield, the idea is a parasite in the minds of corruptible men and women. The sad thing is that Cap stands for one and not the other, when he should be anti-institution all-together. All he's done in Cap 2 is endure a status-quo that is already a world-order, stopping a new world order from emerging. He hasn't "saved the world".

I mean, the film presents us with frequent class-conflict imagery. Look at Bucky's arm with a red star on it. Why does he have it if the Soviets play no part in this film? I mean, apart from pleasing fucking nerd ass comic book fans (it could have been omitted easily, but wasn't for a reason). Bucky stands for the proletariat. He is the downtrodden, the oppressed, the immobile. He is a slave either to the future "state" (Redford, and state is a misnomer), or to The American Ideal (aka Iron Man aka contradiction). Notice how we frequently see his arm damaged by Cap's SHIELD OF TRUTH AND FREEDOM? His arm is paralysed at least twice.

That's no mistake. That didn't have to be in the film. To those who take the hate-on-Michael-Bay approach to films, you may only see this as necessary so that Cap can "escape" or whatever, but they could have written this in so many other ways. The point is we're presented with this imagery because this film is about something more than just some caped crusader beatin' on fools. A man with a soviet star representing the proletariat on his arm has it frequently paralysed? Nah, doesn't mean a thing.
I like Cap. He represents the ideal, not the flag, and he isn't afraid to go rogue when they clash. Timely and necessary.
I agree with you when talking about Cap 1. Not about Cap 2. Notice how often he uses his shield in Cap 2 versus Cap 1? What is a shield? A defensive tool. Let me smash your face in with my defensive tool. It's self defense, though. Seriously, bruh, self defense!

Pre-emptive self-defense. Punishment before the crime. USA bombing "threats" as they emerge from their caves. The shield is thrown, a tool operated. Like drones.

The ideal has been corrupted. Captain America 2 is a story about capitalism. Cap 2 is the twist ending to Cap 1 -- Cap lost, and himself was turned into a tool for the new era of Stark Inc. capitalism, automated super-weapons, and AI algorithms that do the targeting "for us".
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Post » Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:18 pm

But seriously, one thing I really liked about Cap 2 were the fight scenes between Bucky and Cap. Especially all the subtle knife play. That was pretty cool, though likely CGI. It was also pretty hilarious that Sam L Jackson had a fucking minigun in his car. :lol:

E: Falcon was also way cooler and more charismatic than I expected. I thought his wings would look goofy as shit on screen, but they actually kind of worked. I think he's probably the first black superhero in American media where a big deal isn't made about his race, too, which is kind of refreshing. And on that tangent, the movie does try to tackle race in a clumsy way, especially with the Sam L Jackson racial profiling when he thinks he's being pulled over by cops, as well as the fact that the whitebread, blue-eyed, blond-haired all-American boy's only friend in the world is a black man who can fucking fly, and Nick Fury (sort-of friend).

I agree with KFC that some of the gags really fell flat. Also, the colour pallette this time around was oddly muted, and completely opposite to Cap 1 (bright blue weapons, Red Skull etc.), so it was a bit boring to look at. There's probably something to it.

Loved how Bucky kept pulling more guns out of nowhere and they just kept getting knocked out of his hands by Cap. I won't bother going into the symbolism there. Bucky has probably been the most physical of bad guys in the Marvel films, and he definitely came across a little like a Terminator.

I thought I would hate the lift scene from the trailers, but it was actually tense and in-your-face. Also, beginning scene sort of like Metal Gear Solid on the boat is great fun to watch, and probably the part of the film where the sound design is the best, especially with Cap's shield clanging all over the place.

Black Widow is boring, I think, even though she's given a much more expanded role. I don't really 'get' her to be honest. But what we do see is Steve repeatedly reject even the slightest hint of flirting from her, though my feeling is she's probably not all that interested, but is just teasing him about being a hundred year-old virgin.
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